Hello All,

I noticed that Primitive or "Hardshell" Baptists are not only hyper-Calvinists, but do not believe musical instruments belong as part of New Testament worship. They say that the only method of prasing and worshipping the Lord musically is singing, as it says in Eph 5:19. Isn't this what Church of Christ also believe about instruments? They say that the Old Testament use of musical instruments are for the OT only, and you are "adding" to NT worship services something that doesn't belong by using musical instruments. They actually call pianos, and stringed instruments "noise boxes", and they point to people like Spurgeon and others during and before his time and what they say about organs, pianos etc. I play a musical instrument in my church during offering. These guys make it seem like a sin to have instruments as part of the service. What is your take? Thanks

[chette777]

2Sa 6:5 And David and all the house of Israel played before the LORD on all manner of instruments made of fir wood, even on harps, and on psalteries, and on timbrels, and on cornets, and on cymbals.
1Ch 15:16 And David spake to the chief of the Levites to appoint their brethren [to be] the singers with instruments of musick, psalteries and harps and cymbals, sounding, by lifting up the voice with joy.
2Ch 5:13 It came even to pass, as the trumpeters and singers [were] as one, to make one sound to be heard in praising and thanking the LORD; and when they lifted up [their] voice with the trumpets and cymbals and instruments of musick, and praised the LORD, [saying], For [he is] good; for his mercy [endureth] for ever: that [then] the house was filled with a cloud, [even] the house of the LORD;
2Ch 7:6 And the priests waited on their offices: the Levites also with instruments of musick of the LORD, which David the king had made to praise the LORD, because his mercy [endureth] for ever, when David praised by their ministry; and the priests sounded trumpets before them, and all Israel stood.
2Ch 23:13 And she looked, and, behold, the king stood at his pillar at the entering in, and the princes and the trumpets by the king: and all the people of the land rejoiced, and sounded with trumpets, also the singers with instruments of musick, and such as taught to sing praise. Then Athaliah rent her clothes, and said, Treason, Treason.
Am 6:5 That chant to the sound of the viol, [and] invent to themselves instruments of musick, like David; this last verse shows a perversion of worship in Israel.

now in the NT we only read of they sang a hynm, speaking of Jesus and the apostles. or as it was pointed out singing melody in your hearts, but that would be stretching it seeing this singing is in the heart not out loud.

the use of musical instruments would be at best historical tradition in prasing the Lord as the Pslamist used.

it would be presonal preference if people want to or don't want to use instruments.

as long as it is done skillfuly and without drawing attention to the members of the orchestra or worship band. it would be accepted. even Paul said, How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm,....

so singing was part of the NT church Psalms were sung to worship, glorify and thank God. if someone had an instrument they may have played for them.

We are admonished not to argue over doubtful things. this would be one of them. and if someone causes division with it mark them and keep not company with them.

[peopleoftheway]

I think personally when it becomes "electrified" & beat driven in Church is when it becomes dangerous ground. In My backslidden days I produced beat driven, bass driven music (Trance) and the spirit that this kind of Beat and undertone raises is certainly not HOLY its verging on Shamanistic, while the words may be Christ orientated and centered spiritually the Beat almost certainly isn't. Melodic Instrumentation is my opinion is fine as long as the Melody dosent cross over to the point when it creates more emotion than devotion. The emotional conviction is the Job of the Holy Spirit not the Music.

"Can two walk together, except they be AGREED?" Amos 3:3

remember in Ezekiel Satan is portrayed as an Instrument of Music

28:13
Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.

Believe me in this world he uses Music to enslave I personally know this because I was a slave to it until the Grace of our LORD and Saviour set me free.

Posted In the Name of The Almighty the LORD Jesus Christ

[stephanos]

Yeah, I think the instruments in worship is a Romans 14 issue. Personally I come from a background that never sang hymns (I think you baptists call us the 7-11 crowd), but since I've been in fellowship with very conservative Mennonite I've learned to appreciate traditional hymns. Hymns are amazing, but it is taking time for me to love them like I do the worship I grew up with. I also listen to a lot of dub reggae (reggae without words for the most part) as well as gospel reggae, and I love to just sing out random words (most of the time scripture) that fit the melody. Truth be told, it is so amazing to worship without singing from a hymn or reading from a projector. The Word just comes out and I find all those Scriptures I've been learning just flow so nicely as I sing and dance to the melody. God is so good, and truly He is worthy of all our praise.

Much Love in Christ Jesus,
Stephen

[chette777]

be careful I listened to reggai as an unsaved person the Marijauna music of the Jamaican drug cartels.

it has a spirit about it that even masking it in Christian lyrics cannot hide what effects it has on ones own spirit. this is the issue of the whole rock culture in Christian worship. that is why I call most of the so called worship concert music put out by Hillsong, Maranatha and others (Don Moen etc) as Christian ENTERTAINMENT not worship.

I use both hymns and modern songs for worship. but the musical instruments are accoustic and low in volume as not to affect the body with endorphenes and or adreneline. and our song portionof worship is kept to no more than 45 minutes on the average it is 30min. and 45 miniutes to an hour in Bibe Study.

I also would like to point out that the Reggai culture uses a Bible as its foundation that Marajauna use is biblical for spritual development. their version of the Bible has the listing of LORD IN the OT translated JAH. this is the term they use in JAH IREI Man! Reggai is more than just music it is par of the cultural religion of the Jamaicans. Jesus did not redeem cultures just men. so just listening to it is to promote something that is of Satan.

sorry to burst your Bubble Stephanos. but the Jamaican Reggai crowd never learned to rightly divide either.

[stephanos]

Originally Posted by chette777

be careful I listened to reggai as an unsaved person the Marijauna music of the Jamaican drug cartels.

it has a spirit about it that even masking it in Christian lyrics cannot hide what effects it has on ones own spirit. this is the issue of the whole rock culture in Christian worship. that is why I call most of the so called worship concert music put out by Hillsong, Maranatha and others (Don Moen etc) as Christian ENTERTAINMENT not worship.

I use both hymns and modern songs for worship. but the musical instruments are accoustic and low in volume as not to affect the body with endorphenes and or adreneline. and our song portionof worship is kept to no more than 45 minutes on the average it is 30min. and 45 miniutes to an hour in Bibe Study.

I also would like to point out that the Reggai culture uses a Bible as its foundation that Marajauna use is biblical for spritual development. their version of the Bible has the listing of LORD IN the OT translated JAH. this is the term they use in JAH IREI Man! Reggai is more than just music it is par of the cultural religion of the Jamaicans. Jesus did not redeem cultures just men. so just listening to it is to promote something that is of Satan.

sorry to burst your Bubble Stephanos. but the Jamaican Reggai crowd never learned to rightly divide either.

*sigh* Man I so wish you would get over your own understanding. The fruit always reveals the root Chette. You cannot judge all reggae music based on what those with bad fruit have done.

"Sing unto God, sing praises to his name: extol him that rideth upon the heavens by his name JAH, and rejoice before him." Psalms 68:4 King James Bible

Stephen

[chette777]

Man, you need to judge things rightly. the root of reggai is demonic and just becuse you don't know the history of that vodoo psedu-christian cross blend of religions known as Reggai practiced in the Ehiopian Zion Coptic Church. Puts you in the same class as some chariasmatics when it comes to music and dance.

you cannot separate it Reggai from it's roots. Demonic roots for the music. You just want to justify your wanting to listen to reggai. it ok go for it. But all things may be lawful but not all things are expedient.

for those like me who know its back ground and the demonic actiivite that musical style promotes. you would be a offence to weak and immature Christians. Woe to him through whom offences come.

sing all you want unto the Lord, make a joyful noise, shout unto the Lord. but do so without representing the ememy. for Satan doesn't care if you use all the modern reggai beats to worship God. He was the chief worship leader for the angels. surely any style of music is ok if the cheif Angel behind it uses it. all the worship in the Ethiopian Zion Coptic Chruch (reggai religion) uses reggai misic to worship JAH. so go ahead worship them like the infedels do. go for it dude.

but beware of your rewards and crowns that may be forfitted or lost because you liked something that the Devil made available to worship the Lord. many Charismatics are in the same boat.

What should it matter to you your already going against Gods word to rightly divide it so what more can you do to be outside the perfect will of God in your life.

your revealing more of yourself to us than you think.

I judge rigthly and I have the Holy Ghost to hlep me do so. I judge spiritual things by spiritual. not by my feeling or desires for that would be judging things by the flesh. there is a right way to worship and following the ways of a bunch of Devil possessed drug addicts in their style of worship its pure NUTS!

[stephanos]

Originally Posted by chette777

Man, you need to judge things rightly. the root of reggai is demonic and just becuse you don't know the history of that vodoo psedu-christian cross blend of religions known as Reggai practiced in the Ehiopian Zion Coptic Church. Puts you in the same class as some chariasmatics when it comes to music and dance.

you cannot separate it Reggai from it's roots. Demonic roots for the music. You just want to justify your wanting to listen to reggai. it ok go for it. But all things may be lawful but not all things are expedient.

for those like me who know its back ground and the demonic actiivite that musical style promotes. you would be a offence to weak and immature Christians. Woe to him through whom offences come.

sing all you want unto the Lord, make a joyful noise, shout unto the Lord. but do so without representing the ememy. for Satan doesn't care if you use all the modern reggai beats to worship God. He was the chief worship leader for the angels. surely any style of music is ok if the cheif Angel behind it uses it. all the worship in the Ethiopian Zion Coptic Chruch (reggai religion) uses reggai misic to worship JAH. so go ahead worship them like the infedels do. go for it dude.

but beware of your rewards and crowns that may be forfitted or lost because you liked something that the Devil made available to worship the Lord. many Charismatics are in the same boat.

What should it matter to you your already going against Gods word to rightly divide it so what more can you do to be outside the perfect will of God in your life.

your revealing more of yourself to us than you think.

I judge rigthly and I have the Holy Ghost to hlep me do so. I judge spiritual things by spiritual. not by my feeling or desires for that would be judging things by the flesh. there is a right way to worship and following the ways of a bunch of Devil possessed drug addicts in their style of worship its pure NUTS!

are you done yet?

[chette777]

Proverbs 28:23 He that rebuketh a man afterwards shall find more favour than he that flattereth with the tongue.

Proverbs 27:5 Open rebuke is better than secret love.

seems like someone can't handle a little rebuke about reggai music and its devilish roots.

My understanding comes from knowing the word of God and following that word even to my own hurt. which means I would deny myself personal pleasure and interests in order to please God in my Life. and not using types of music for worship would fall under that.

Time to grow now that you know the truth about reggai. or will you continue to rebel?

[chette777]

Or Better yet!

why not start using rap and hip hop to worship the Lord. I know a man here who has built a whole ministry on it. When I shared with him his lead dancers were not even saved and still using drugs he admitted it. he didn't care. these hip hop supposed ex gang memebers are bringing him tons of money in support from Europe and the States. getting them saved was not in his plan only reaping the harvest of blessings (money).

how about using a little Bump and Grind Rythym and Blues to worship the Lord. or Roudy Red neck country like ol Charley Daniels used to sing. How about using hymns like "A mighty fortress is our God" to march to war like the Kaizars did in WWI.

I mean we can take it to the extremes for you if you want and show you the history to all roots of music. God didn't seem to care to much for those who were using all sorts of music to worship him because their hearts weren't right with him nor were they in His will to begin with. Look in this verse and you judge.

Amos 6:1-6 Woe to them that are at ease in Zion, and trust in the mountain of Samaria, which are named chief of the nations, to whom the house of Israel came! Pass ye unto Calneh, and see; and from thence go ye to Hamath the great: then go down to Gath of the Philistines: be they better than these kingdoms? or their border greater than your border? Ye that put far away the evil day, and cause the seat of violence to come near; That lie upon beds of ivory, and stretch themselves upon their couches, and eat the lambs out of the flock, and the calves out of the midst of the stall; That chant to the sound of the viol, and invent to themselves instruments of musick, like David; That drink wine in bowls, and anoint themselves with the chief ointments: but they are not grieved for the affliction of Joseph.

go ahead invent to yourselves ways to worship but know that the Lord is not with all your ways because you are not in all His. Just as Israel was. this age will end in a great Apostasy and not to long from now we will see it end.