[Luke]

This may not be the best forum for this question, since it seems to be more of a discussion forum than a fellowship forum, but I was wondering what it means to love Jesus.

I love Jesus because he saved me from my sins, and died on the cross for me, but as a human, I am unable to express it with any great depth of emotion. I cannot fathom the depths of love that Christ shewed on that cross, and I feel that I am doing him a dishonour, and almost simply paying "lip service" to God in my prayers.

I want to love Jesus more. I want to desire his truth more and more. How does one do this? I try to keep his commandments "if ye love me, keep my commandments", but fail oftentimes. I pray for grace to trust him more, and love him more, but I still feel as though I just don't love him enough.

I feel ashamed at times that I don't love or express my love for God as much as I ought to. I just can't do it. I don't know how to express love to a God I cannot see. I don't mean that I don't believe. I do. I believe the Gospel as best I can understand it. I believe Jesus died for my sins, and that I have received him by faith the best way I know how. I know I am saved by Jesus blood. But I don't know how to show gratitude for that. Works of mine are nothing. Words of mine are nothing. Is there anything I can do to love God more?

I often feel that myself. A suggestion: Pray to Him just what you have posted here. Confess what you have confessed here, directly to His ear. Ask Him to give you that love for Him. Talk to Him about all those feelings, in as much detail and with as much feeling as you have about your failure. Everything you have just posted and more. Ask Him for forgiveness and repentance. Ask Him to give you understanding of anything you don't understand, the ability to obey anything you feel you don't yet obey. It's a good thing, by the way, to recognize your failure, it leads to humility and renewed dedication. You may go on feeling you can't love him enough, it could even get worse, you may even think you love him less and less, but that too is a good thing. You will be drawing closer to Him in your weakness.

Biblical love is not an emotion (though at times it will affect our emotions), not a feeling - it is an action - see 1 Corinthians 13. As you have stated, our love is shown by our obedience to the Lord - it is our motivation for obeying. We can't say we love the Lord and rebel against Him at the same time. Love would be placing Him first in everything we do.

[pbiwolski]

Originally Posted by Luke

But I don't know how to show gratitude for that. Works of mine are nothing. Words of mine are nothing. Is there anything I can do to love God more?

I Peter 2:5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

Heb. 13:15-16 By him therefore let us offer the sacrifice of praise to God continually, that is, the fruit of our lips giving thanks to his name. But to do good and to communicate (giving) forget not: for with such sacrifices God is well pleased.

You can rest in that He is pleased (Rev. 4:11 - and that's your no. 1 job).

I think the feeling of love is implied in the commandment to love God and neighbor. I don't see how we can be motivated to do the actions of love without at least some of this feeling. I think Luke's WANTING to love Him is part of that feeling. "So panteth my soul after Thee" is about a feeling, and when Jesus asks Peter if he loves Him I think a feeling is strongly implied. "If you love Me, feed My sheep" shows that the love comes before the action. "If you love Me you will obey My commandments" also.

The Bible does not focus on the feelings - we are to live by faith, not by feelings. Those will fluctuate. This is what God says, which shows me God considers love more than a feeling:

1 John 5:2-3 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

This says our love for God IS our obedience to Him, not just that it is the motivation for our obedience. Love is obeying God - that is how we can still love our enemies. Though we may not have fuzzy feelings for them, we can still do good towards them and obey God's commandments toward them (ie. don't steal from them, don't lie to them, don't lust for them or commit adultery/fornication with them, etc.). Though if your definition of love is a feeling, tell me, how do you LOVE your enemies?

Oh I know there are many ways feelings can deceive and can't be our guide, but I do think you couldn't live the Christian life at all without having changed feelings.

I don't think that quote, "For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments" implies that we can just grit our teeth and obey even if we have no desire whatever to obey -- even if we could at first we couldn't do it consistently for the rest of our lives -- but that some degree of the feeling of love of God will work itself out in the desire to obey that leads to keeping His commandments. In fact I think we come to love His commandments and we couldn't obey them if we didn't. "Oh how I love thy law, it is my meditation all the day."

We can be so full of hurt and anger at being mistreated that blessing our enemies, or forgiving them is an emotional impossibility. SOMETHING has to change in the feelings away from hatred and toward love, however slightly, even a less severe degree of hatred, in order for us to obey in this case. It's like when Corrie Ten Boom was faced with the newly born-again Nazi who had abused her sister when they were in the concentration camp, and had to pray the Lord would give her the ability to shake his hand. Some people have more ability to act against their feelings than others do. I have to actually see the situation differently and feel at least a little differently about it before I can obey. I have to see that I'm no better than my enemies, for instance, or be reminded that the Lord is my reward, and then my feelings change enough to do good to them. If you can obey effectively in spite of deep anger at someone, I admire that ability, but I don't have it.

Have you read Jonathan Edwards' The Religious Affections? He covers the whole range of the subject including all the errors of trusting in feelings instead of acting on simple faith.

(I guess maybe I'm saying that faith changes our feelings. I don't want to ground our faith in feelings, though.)

Maybe this is clearer: "For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments" is a warning that we can't say we love God if we don't keep His commandments. In fact this is a warning about relying on a superficial feeling we call love. True love obeys, period. I don't think it means that we can obey WITHOUT that feeling of love though, which is what you seemed to be implying.

[Diligent]

Originally Posted by Connie

Maybe this is clearer: "For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments" is a warning that we can't say we love God if we don't keep His commandments. In fact this is a warning about relying on a superficial feeling we call love. True love obeys, period. I don't think it means that we can obey WITHOUT that feeling of love though, which is what you seemed to be implying.

It's not a warning; it's a statement of fact. I don't see how you can read it any other way in 1st John 5. It's not about feelings at all.

We're not saying we can't "feel" a love for God -- just that the Bible doesn't put the emphasis on such emotions. Which is not surprising, since human emotion is such a fleeting thing.

Also, the emphasis on the commandments in 1st John 5 is that of believing God. I take from 1Jo 5 that first and foremost, loving God is believing him. Stemming from that comes obedience.

I didn't "put an emphasis on such emotions" either. This thread is ABOUT love so I'm talking about love. Yes, loving God is believing God. You don't really love God if you don't believe Him, that's what I meant by how it's a warning against an empty profession of love to God, which seems pretty obvious to me. You all seem to want to reduce that statement to belief alone, as if the love part of the statement is meaningless. Try believing God with a feeling of hate toward God.