[bibleprotector]

no matter how soft the objections to them are

Priscilla and Aquila discerned that Apollos was not advanced in his doctrine. They therefore sought to bring him up to their understanding.

Ac 18:26 And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: whom when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto them, and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly.

They did not want Apollos to stay at a low level, namely, that he should attempt to preach Christ with the doctrine of John the Baptist. It is quite right to lay out a greater understanding of the Scripture.

Having been shown, the onus is on people whether or not they respond positively to the constructive points raised about their current views and actions.

Once Apollos heard the way of God more perfectly, he advanced forward in great power.

[Brother Tim]

Brother Tony, you and I see things slightly differently, but I look forward to seeing you on FFF. I don't go there for fellowship, I go for combat training. There are some decent folks there. ChaplainPaul and Mitex(Brent) are brethren-in-arms. .... then there is roby Now, ransom makes roby look like an angel.

Suit up, Brother!

[Daniel Haifley]

Quote -"Unashamedly, I say that we had rather have one standard, according to Isaiah’s prophecies (e.g. 59:19), than to have what the Dean Burgon Society labours to attain, which is thousands of translations to every tribe and dialect, rather than conformity to one standard for all, made common, and proved to be true.

I find that David Livingston taught the brightest and most zealous natives English, and that they would be set to be the future spiritual leaders. I find that in Australia, the Aborigines were taught English, and it took until 2007 for a complete Bible (a modern version) to be made in just one of their dialects. I say that the aims of Richard Hakluyt, Oliver Cromwell and others were higher, and that the William Carey Bible Society is viewing things with the limitations of the nineteenth century, rather than having the nineteenth century truth advancing for all."

This was what one of you brethren said. I don't know if it is the view of all. The question I have is this - if people must learn English to hear the wonderful Word of God, Why did God give the gift of tongues in Acts chapter 2 so that all could hear in the language of their birth?

There is absolutely no scriptural backing for such a claim. It is a strong place to stand when you must stand there with only the wisdom of man. I believe that God, Himself, was involved in the translation of the King James Version, but I don't believe that He is limited to one language. In fact the early church struggled with the different languages. I Corinthians 14 talks of the tongues of men (the many languages in the world), and the tongues of angels (every listener understands in his own language). I have personally documented over 5,000 language groups that have not yet heard one verse of scripture in their language. One such group has over 8,000,000 souls. Am I to understand that we must teach everyone good enough English to actually understand the Bible? It will take anywhere from 5-15 years to get them the Bible in their own language, and then it is accessable to all.

All King James Bible Believers are men of faith, and I am blessed to be one of those. We believe that God keeps His promises. However, faith is not a blind acceptance of some mans opinion. It is the substance of things hoped for-the evidence of things not seen. It is always anchored in the pomises of God. God did not promise that He would give the Bible in one language and then everyone must come to that language. He promised to preserve it, but He also promised to give it to the whole world.

Thanks for considering my thoughts.

[Brother Tim]

He promised to preserve it, but He also promised to give it to the whole world.

First, I completely understand the prospective that many KJB followers have toward getting the Word out into other languages. There is a misconception, however, towards those who emphasize the need for training people of other languages to read English. I, for one, do not claim that one must read English in order to learn about God or His Word. What I do believe is that all other language translations must defer to the KJB as the final authority.

As much as some may desire, there will never be a time on earth when the Scriptures have been accurately and perfectly translated into every language, or even into every major language. There is not a single translation on earth today that believers acknowledge as the complete and perfect Words of God other than the KJB. I do not see a day when that will change.

[Will Kinney]

Originally Posted by Brother Tim

First, I completely understand the prospective that many KJB followers have toward getting the Word out into other languages. There is a misconception, however, towards those who emphasize the need for training people of other languages to read English. I, for one, do not claim that one must read English in order to learn about God or His Word. What I do believe is that all other language translations must defer to the KJB as the final authority.

As much as some may desire, there will never be a time on earth when the Scriptures have been accurately and perfectly translated into every language, or even into every major language. There is not a single translation on earth today that believers acknowledge as the complete and perfect Words of God other than the KJB. I do not see a day when that will change.

Hi brother Tim. I totally agree with you on this. Most KJB onlyists will agree that God can and does use other inferiour bible versions to bring people to faith in Christ as their one and only Saviour. But that does not mean that those other versions are the complete, perfect and inerrant words of God. In fact, most Christians today do not believe that any Bible in any language on earth today is the complete and inerrant Scriptures; yet I believe most of them are still Christians. Belief in the inerrancy of Scripture is not necessary to salvation, but you sure miss out on a lot when you begin to deny or disbelieve this doctrine. The only Bible seriously defended by thousands of Bible believers as being the inerrant words of God is that one Book that stands out above all others - the Authorized King James Holy Bible.

Gracias,
Aceptos en el Amado - Efesios 1:6

[Will Kinney]

Originally Posted by Daniel Haifley

I believe that God, Himself, was involved in the translation of the King James Version, but I don't believe that He is limited to one language. ... God did not promise that He would give the Bible in one language and then everyone must come to that language. He promised to preserve it, but He also promised to give it to the whole world.

Thanks for considering my thoughts.

Hi Daniel. If you are talking about a complete, inspired and inerrant Bible, then do you actually know of any other Bible in any language that you also consider to be the complete and inerrant words of God? If so, could you please tell us where we can get a copy of it so we can compare it to our King James Bible to see the differences and similarities?

By the way, where did God ever promise to give a perfect and inerrant Bible to anybody, let alone to the whole world? Do you have that verse handy for us?

I know that Christ said the gospel of the kingdom would be preached in the whole world, but where do we have any promise from God about a complete, inerrant and inspired Bible being given to anyone?

Are you sure you are getting your thinking from the Book or are you just following what has been referred to as "the wisdom of men"?

Thanks,

Will Kinney

[Daniel Haifley]

First of all I want to say that I've gone back and scan read what a lot of you have said in this thread. Several have articulated my thoughts quite well. So I understand that this is a cross section of ideas which I appreciate. I will attempt to give every statement the respect it deserves, and I am quite certain that none of us agree on everything.

Will, I believe in the verbal, plenary, inspiration of the scriptures. Verbal -meaning God gave the words to the holy men of old (Peter 1:21) Plenary-meaning God gave us all that we need and that we need all that we have (2 Timothy 3:16-17) Inspiration- meaning that God was the source of the words and God is the source of the change that comes from the words.

Is a copy of the original writings inspired? Does it even say that they were all written down? It says they "spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost." Was the original inspiration written or spoken? In some cases it was written (ie. Moses) in others it was spoken (ie. Peter at pentecost). If a copy of the original transmission of the scripture was inspired - is a translation of the original transmission also equally inspired? An interesting thought here is that the Word was given by inspiration, but so also was Adam's life given by inspiration. I believe spiritual life is given by "in"spiration.

I am not one of the great teachers of our time, but I am willing to be taught. I am a Bible believer but I have found it hard to put an Infinite God into the box of my finite mind. I am enjoying all of the comments on this thread, and have been instructed in many ways, however don't try to box me into a corner that you have designed for me.

[tonybones2112]

Originally Posted by bibleprotector

I believe that the Scripture indicates the proper view regarding the KJB in the end times. That the KJB should be exalted seems to be a good thing, after all, Psalm 56 talks about praising God’s Word, and Isaiah 42:21 says, “The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness' sake; he will magnify the law, and make it honourable.”

But the OT, when spiritually applied. is for the Church, as Romans 15:4 states, “For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope.”

I do not think we should water down our doctrines just because they might be unpopular in the eyes of Leftists etc. We should be zealous, and speak with conviction and clarity about what is right and good.

We believe the KJB is perfect. We believe that it is the best anyone in the world can have. We are not denying that the Scripture and the Gospel has been in other languages, but we seek to promote and allow for the best for all folk in all nations, which means having a common standard Bible. I believe that this is the basis of true Christian unity as opposed to having many versions as well as continuing to uphold many varying translations.

I would even go so far to suggest that when Christ said, “Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.” (Mt 10:34), that He was thinking about the Holy Ghost’s work with the KJB as a particular fulfilment of this prophecy, because we all know how divisive Satan has been in regards to the modern versionists against the steadfast stand for the KJB.

The answer to that question can be given on the basis of this question: The Geneva Bible, was it of God, or of men?

The answer to that accusation can be given on the basis of this question: Do KJBOs labour to ban the Geneva Bible?

1Cor. 14:21 says, “In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord.” How will Gentiles speak to the Jews? At one time it was in the Greek language. But now most Jews know English. Also, this prophecy indicates that the Jews would continue to resist the Gospel in this present circumstance. However, we find that there are more prophecies in Scripture which build further. Clearly, God has been speaking with the use of the KJB to the Jews. Our expectation should be for the increase of this, not a decrease.


The Romanists are not just disobeying God, they were not God’s envoys, missionaries, representatives or ambassadors since the early centuries when the Roman Church went into perdition.

If anyone actually believes that, then they might actually believe that all Protestants are Roman Catholics because, like Catholics, Protestants want to convert the world to their own religion. (E.g. cats have 4 legs, my dog has 4 legs, therefore my dog is a cat.)

I believe this is a foolish question.

Erasmus and Tyndale desired Turks and Saracens to be saved. Knowing English is not a prerequisite for salvation. However, it is quite useful to have the printing press as an aid to salvation. The English language is one of those things which has the greatest potential for the furtherest instruction of benighted souls.


First, Gen. 11:1 “And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech.” This was the case with God's intention in creation. We should not attempt to form a doctrine which prohibits ONE LANGUAGE.

Second, God scattered people and languages as a judgment on sin. However, the advent of Abram in the end of this chapter is the portal by which this is reversed. (We are the children of Abraham, and the blessing is to all nations of the earth!)

Third, in the Millennial reign of Christ we see a one world kingdom. This is not bad, but good. Yet today, the idea of a one world kingdom means something bad. Now consider: if born again people are in the future using one language as common, this could not be bad like the antichrist kingdom, since,
a. they are good, godly, righteous people,
b. they are the same Church that Paul was part of,
c. they are doing so because it is part of God’s plan.

It seems to me that God, in His Divine Providence, has raised up the KJB and made the English language to be global so that the pure Word would be taught by the Christian advance of the best doctrines in one language as a witness to the world would actually work out to the confounding of evil and to those who mock Christianity because of divisions. What would do more to heal and bring unity than one true focus, namely, to have the very Word of God in English as the focus of all true believers in the whole earth before the return of Christ, so that we would be, “the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.” (1 Tim. 3:15b).

Thank you for replying to my message. I have a couple questions to clarify further:

1. 2Co 2:17 For we are not as many, which corrupt the word of God: but as of sincerity, but as of God, in the sight of God speak we in Christ.

Is Manny, Daniel, and Brett trying to corrupt the word of God or spread it into the hands of souls that have no word of God?

2. Are they with us(the Church, not just this forum) or against us?

3. Place a copy, in Polish, of The Godfather on a table and place the Polish(I believe it's the GDANSKA) version of some 400 years ago next to it.

4. Which book will a lost Pole find the gospel of Christ in? Which book will then work effectually in him or her who has believed?

I apologize for not answering you sooner.

Grace and peace.

Tony

[tonybones2112]

Originally Posted by bibleprotector

Priscilla and Aquila discerned that Apollos was not advanced in his doctrine. They therefore sought to bring him up to their understanding.

Ac 18:26 And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: whom when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto them, and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly.

They did not want Apollos to stay at a low level, namely, that he should attempt to preach Christ with the doctrine of John the Baptist. It is quite right to lay out a greater understanding of the Scripture.

Having been shown, the onus is on people whether or not they respond positively to the constructive points raised about their current views and actions.

Once Apollos heard the way of God more perfectly, he advanced forward in great power.

Brother, yes, Apollos taught the Baptism of John, the gospel of Peter, James and John, the "Great Commission", that millions still persist in teaching, and not Paul's ministry of reconciliation to God through Christ with the revelation of the mystery that Jews and Gentile were now equal in the Body Of Christ whereas under Peter, James, and John, salvation to Gentiles was only through Israel(the ministry of The Twelve. These two gospels are found in Galatians 2:9-12. In Acts 3 Peter taught that national Israel's sins would be blotted out at the end of the Tribulation, Paul, Aquila, and Pricilla taught that there was NOW no need for John's gospel, and that Jew and Gentile were equal in the Body with sins washed away NOW.

Grace and peace

Tony

[Will Kinney]

Originally Posted by Daniel Haifley

Will, I believe in the verbal, plenary, inspiration of the scriptures. Verbal -meaning God gave the words to the holy men of old (Peter 1:21) Plenary-meaning God gave us all that we need and that we need all that we have (2 Timothy 3:16-17) Inspiration- meaning that God was the source of the words and God is the source of the change that comes from the words.

Is a copy of the original writings inspired? Does it even say that they were all written down? It says they "spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost." Was the original inspiration written or spoken? In some cases it was written (ie. Moses) in others it was spoken (ie. Peter at pentecost). If a copy of the original transmission of the scripture was inspired - is a translation of the original transmission also equally inspired? An interesting thought here is that the Word was given by inspiration, but so also was Adam's life given by inspiration. I believe spiritual life is given by "in"spiration.

I am not one of the great teachers of our time, but I am willing to be taught. I am a Bible believer but I have found it hard to put an Infinite God into the box of my finite mind. I am enjoying all of the comments on this thread, and have been instructed in many ways, however don't try to box me into a corner that you have designed for me.

Hi Daniel. Thanks for your thoughts. However you seem to be avoiding a direct answer. It looks like it is YOU who has boxed himself into a corner and since you cannot rationally defend your previous statements, you now charge that it is I who am boxing you into this corner you have made for yourself. I am just asking you to back up what you say you believe.

First of all, you say you believe in the inspiration of "the scriptures". Great! We are agreed on that. But "the scriptures" are divine words WRITTEN DOWN. The word "Scriptures" comes from the verb "to write"; not "to speak", nor "to give life to", nor "to breathe into".

Previously you stated:

“I believe in the verbal, plenary inspiration of the scriptures. I also believe that God is not limited to one language (English is not the language of heaven-Americans are not the chosen). He can inspire in 18 languages at one time -if He so chooses, ie. Acts 2.”

Then you went on to say:

" I believe that God, Himself, was involved in the translation of the King James Version, but I don't believe that He is limited to one language.

All King James Bible Believers are men of faith, and I am blessed to be one of those. We believe that God keeps His promises. However, faith is not a blind acceptance of some mans opinion. It is the substance of things hoped for-the evidence of things not seen. It is always anchored in the promises of God. God did not promise that He would give the Bible in one language and then everyone must come to that language. He promised to preserve it, but He also promised to give it to the whole world."

The context of our whole discussion is whether or not there exists such a thing as the complete, inspired and inerrant words of God in book form (the Scriptures) or not. I and many others believe there is and it is called the Authorized King James Holy Bible.

You say you believe God is not limited to one language, and that God has promised to give "the scriptures" to the whole world. Fine. All I am asking you to do is to tell us exactly where we can get a copy of "the scriptures" in any language other than the English of the King James Bible.

If you cannot do so, then it is YOU who is basing your beliefs on what you referred to as "the wisdom of men". It would be great if God has indeed done it the way you seem to think He did. So, where is the proof of your theory? Can you show us the Book in any language other than the English of the King James Bible?

Otherwise you are professing a faith in something that you know does not exist and have taken the position of most Bible agnostics today who tell us that only the originals were inspired. We are then left with a bunch of hypothetical, imaginary, philosophical and speculative "inspired Scriptures" that you have never seen and cannot show us.

All I am asking you to do is to concretely back up your previous statements about God not being limited to one language as far as a complete, inspired and inerrant Bible.

Will you do that for us? (I trow not;-)

Will Kinney