[scott]

Originally Posted by martydavis

Romans 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

Praying in tongues, at home in your prayer closet, is where the unknown tongues should be uttered - not as a public display in church.

In church you will know when there will be an interpretation - the Holy Spirit will prompt you (providing you are listening)

I've often wondered why, when the Bible clearly states the Spirit will make intercession for us with groanings "which cannot be uttered"--why do some try to "utter" them??

God bless, Scott

[chette777]

Marty,

just to set the record straight.

there is not such things as UNKNOWN TONGUES (PLURAL) Paul mentions an unknown tongue(singualr) the gift in 1Cor12 is gift of tongues (plural) and Interpretation or Tongues (plural). and there is not record of that ever happening. the only tongue is that is singular is an UNKNOWN TONGUE. that should be enlightening to those who speak in unknown tongues because if there is more than one unknown tongue it is not what Paul was speaking about. So where do they all come from?

Every person who speaks in an unknown tongue should be speaking the same unknown tongue as anyone else who is speaking in an unknown tongue. it would be only one unknown nor many. But I hear them speak in many different unknown tongues and that is not Biblical.

[chette777]

Post Script

two examples of unknown tongue were spoken

once to Jesus and he heard the father speak fro heave. those around him heard only thunder but knew it was a voice. Jesus said he was glad for the voice for their sakes.

and Paul heard the Lord speak but those around him heard a voice but did not understand what was said.

[stephanos]

I don't wish to enter into strife and debate with you Chette. I respectfully do not agree with the filter you use to read Scriptures. To one man dispensationalism is rightly dividing the word of truth, to another it is man made doctrine and reasoning around the Scriptures. If you need this forum to get all puffed up in your correctness then have at it. Again, I respectfully disagree. Can we still be friends and walk together in this difference of opinion? I hope so. I hope you will not get your feathers to ruffled by my stance on the Word of God. I've wasted to much time already discussing the Bible with calvinists and dispensationalists, and unfortunately most of them think you're a heretic if you don't agree with them. I do not agree with them. I can tell you what I do believe in. I believe that Jesus Christ is Lord AND Saviour, and that the King James Bible is His inerrant Words. Can we meet there?

for Jesus' sake,
Stephen

[chette777]

Stepahnos,

If you say all scripture is applicable today then fine. But you will have a hard time fulfilling some of its requirements such as the example I gave in Matthew.

My Point is simple. If you know where to divide then you can make distinctions of what does apply's today and what doesn't. Matthew 5:42 does not apply today or you would have complied.

No, I respect your veiw and opinion. we can walk a distance

But I am insulted at you opinion that I am all puffed up in my correctness. I was showing how rightly dividing works in the field of application today. And refuting your telling me not to tell people that not all scriputre are for them today.

Because if they are all for today as you say you beleive, and that you beleive the KJV is your final Authority. You didn't fulfill to give me what I asked, so you violated scripture by no obeying this doctrine of Christ and the Holy Ghost is either greived or quenched in your life until you obey

but if you don't agree this particular scripture Matt 5:42 is for today then you are a divider of Scripture known as a Dispensationkist.

So for the record of all reading Please answer this, Is Matt 5:42 for today or not?

[Brother Tim]

Chette, Yes, it is for today ... when taken in harmony with all Scriptures related to the topic. No verse should be isolated to establish a doctrine.

[chette777]

no one isolated it. It is inside it context which is Kingdom Doctrine. but if you try and apply it today it wont happen because people wont submit to it. if you were in the kingdom and did not comply you would end up like Ananias and Saphira.

I believe we can get certain apllications from all scripture. and you can learn lessons from all scriptures. however this particular passage is for the earthly Kingdom which is not yet here. ALL scripture is profitable for Dcotrine not all scripture is doctrine.

But, Tim if want to beleive it is applicable to you today give me $100 please. You must comply with Matthew 5:42 or you will be disobeident the teaching of Jesus.

and it would be nice for you to list all scripture related to the topic of Matt 5:42. you will see all the scritptures related are preparation for the earthly Kingdom. When is the Kingdom? has Christ extablished his earthly kingdom now or will it come later? if you think the Kingdom is now what happened to the Grteat Tribulation? the anti-christ? the 144,000 male virgin Jews. the destruction of the devils and the binding of Satan for 1,000 years?

If I take it and compare it to Pauls teaching (which is what we need to do to establish a doctrine for today) he does not agree. Pauls says for us to communicate with those whom teach? he says we should give cheerfully and without grudging or covetousness. nowhere does Paul teach give to him who would ask. so it wont apply if Paul's teaching doesn't agree.

Look so far No one challenged to follow this doctrine has done so. if it is for today why has Stephanos not complied with that DOCTRINE of Christ? the reason is simple it is not applicable today. hence no fear in not complying on yours or any one elses heart.

is it for us today? only in the sence that it is in our Bibles and we can read it today is if for su. but is it for us to follow today? NO it is not or you will need to comply.

[stephanos]

2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

I do believe that all Scriptures have context, and this is important when one tries to find a practical application for a particlular passage. However, I've seen the way you dispensationalists divide away the Scriptures and I am absolutely against this practice. Concernin your quoting Matthew, this is precisely my point I'm trying to make about you guys. Not only have you divided away most of the Holy Bible, but the very Words of Jesus Christ!

Matthew 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 22:37-40 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Brother, in all honesty, I do not want to get into this with you. It has been my experience that people who've made up their minds on something are not easily swayed to look at things differently. Know that I like you have made up my mind concerning these things.

Much Love in Christ Jesus,
Stephen

[Brother Tim]

Chette, please tell me where and how best to get your money to you. God blessed me with a few extra hours, so at this moment I have $100 that I can give.

[chette777]

Stephanos,

I looked at it from your veiw for many years and the only reasonable way is to rightly divide the scripture. So stop accusing me of being closed minded. that is your opinion it is wrong but your opinion never the less.but you tell me what your feel is the Context of Mattew 5:42? Your mind seem more made up and unswayable than mine.

I have divided away nothing from the scriptures nor added to it. I didn't tell any one not to obey any commandment of Christ or God. I said not all scripture is applicable to them today. there is a big difference between those things. Telling them certain scriptures are not apllicable today is not telling people to not keep the comandments of Christ or God. Those are false accusations of yours towards me and other dispensationalist on this site. Hyper dispensationalist do what you say. but we are not them so don't confuse us with them. There is a right way and a wrong way to divide scripture. But either way it must be done.

I took nothing out of context using Matthew 5:42 in the object lesson I challenged you with. but you tell me what your feel is the Context of Mattew 5:42? for me it is Jesus teaching Israel to prepare them for the Earhtly Kingdom that He has come to set up. Did he set up the Earthly Kingdom? Not yet.

Ok so I want to give your the benefit of the doubt. You've said how important it is in keeping context in finding a practicle application of srcripture, the one we are discussing is Matt 5:42. What is your practicle application of this scripture in context for today?