[chette777]

Wake up and smell the coffee.

you can't use Kingdom Teaching in this dispensation. men will not receive it. but in the Kingdom if it is used properly if the repenting party wont obey not only will he/she be treated as a heathen but the Lord Jesus is on His throne to Judge them henceforth.

Matthew 18 is Kingdom Dispensational teaching the reason very few use it is because used in the wrong dispensation it doesn't work.

What in Matthew 18 "doesn't work" today?

[George]

Originally Posted by kstsells

As to Ruckman... I am TOTALLY 110% KJV all the way and I appreciate his stand on that. BUT I would rather not have someone like him on our side. He is very offensive and the Bible tells us in II Timothy 2:24
"And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,". From the very first time I saw Ruckman on a video I was just turned off by him. Something just told me that he may not be all he was professing to be. Then later by chance I heard about his multiple marriages. Then it made sense to me why someone that I know who is really a good Christian, thinks marriage, divorce and remarriage is ok. He is a HUGE Ruckman fan. He says that the Bible just means that we are to only be married to one woman at a time when it says "the husband of one wife".

So you see, Ruckman has justified the sin in his own life by preaching that it is ok and that he was the wounded one, the offended one in his past marriages. And in doing this he has made it OK for thousands of his followers. Which is a great example of why we should be followers of Jesus Christ and not man. I do not advocate divorce but I could NEVER stay married to a man like Ruckman He is insulting and abrasive. I am so thankful for the man God gave me. And I am thankful for His Word, that it will stand FOREVER and that He is the Defender and Keeper of it!

Aloha sister,

A caveat: (this is not meant as an admonishment, reproof, or rebuke - so please don't take it as such).

I have read approximately 75 books by Peter Ruckman and probably 50 booklets. I have also listened to hundreds of hours of his preaching and teaching tapes. I can state here unequivacably, that NOWHERE in all of brother Ruckman's material that I have read, or heard, or seen, has he EVER APPROVED OF or RECOMMENDED DIVORCE.

On the contrary, he has stated on several occasions (in his books & tapes) that he is completely AGAINST DIVORCE. His testimony has been consistent for the 40 years that I have been acquainted with him.

If you haven't read my personal testimony regarding brother Ruckman (This Forum: "Chit Chat" Section, Page 10, Post #91), I ask you to check it out. If you haven't the time to read my testimony let me reiterate what I personally know about Peter Ruckman's marriage "status": He married to his first wife when he was "lost - unsaved" (They had 5 children together). After 16 years of marriage, and a few years after he got saved, and started serving the Lord - she left him, and she filed for the divorce (he didn't).

He waited 10 years and remarried a Southern Christian woman, who left him after 16 years of marriage - She ran off with a policeman ("Christian") who was attending the church that brother Ruckman was pastoring, and she also filed for divorce (again - he didn't).

He married another woman from his church after that, and they have been married since 1989. I'm so glad that my wife of 47 years hasn'r left me, and at times I probably have given her cause, but she has chosen to stay with me.

I imagine that being married to a man like Peter Ruckman would be a challenge and a trial, but he believed in "for better or for worse" and made every effort to reconcile both marriages and both wives (at different times) would have none of it. What's a man (or woman) to do if his spouse leaves? In the Western World (USA included), people get divorced for no reason at all, and there is no way that someone can prevent it if the other spouse wants out of the marriage.

In his auto-biography "The Full Cup", he reaffirms, in no uncertain terms that he is absolutely opposed to divorce "for any reason". He doesn't approve of divorce; and he does not recommend it for any one for any reason.

If you are inclined to, you should read his auto-biography. At least you would be hearing from the "source" direct, instead of hearsay.

Yours for Christ, George

What's a man (or woman) to do if his spouse leaves?

Stay single/unmarried until the ex-spouse dies.

[George]

You missed my point (again) brother - I wasn't referring to remarriage, I was referring to stopping the divorce. No one in the Western world can STOP their spouse from divorcing them! If a husband or wife does not want a divorce and their spouse insists on one there is nothing that the other spouse can do to prevent it (short of shooting the spouse that wants out ), which definitely the Bible would prohibit and so would the law!

This also fits in with the "overall context" - 1Cr 7:10 - And unto the married I command, [yet] not I, but the Lord, Let not the wife depart from [her] husband:

1Cr 7:11 But and if she depart, let her remain unmarried, or be reconciled to [her] husband: and let not the husband put away [his] wife.

"the ONLY WAY a Christian is free in a divorce is when the non-Christian leaves the marriage"?? not according to the above verses in the SAME CHAPTER. Notice vs. 11 - "....."let her remain UNMARRIED" which means she became unmarried the moment she left, or deserted and she is to either stay that way or be reconciled to her husband, and the husband is not to put away the wife. There is a big difference in what it says above, and "some others" that read 1Cor7 the way a Roman Catholic would read it, and look down their noses on Christians who have been divorced and remarried as second class Christians.

Well then I guess your standards are higher than God's because Jesus Christ allowed for divorce because of fornication in Matt.19:3-9, why? because fornication divides the one flesh Gen. 2:24, and creates a new union, 1 Cor 6:16. The other case is 1 Cor 7:12-15. While Paul recommends that the deserted spouse remain unmarried in vs 27, he also says that it is not a sin if they remarry (vs 28) and the only condition to the deserted spouse remarrying is that they marry a saved person.

Originally Posted by browilder61

Well then I guess your standards are higher than God's because Jesus Christ allowed for divorce because of fornication in Matt.19:3-9, why? because fornication divides the one flesh Gen. 2:24, and creates a new union, 1 Cor 6:16. The other case is 1 Cor 7:12-15. While Paul recommends that the deserted spouse remain unmarried in vs 27, he also says that it is not a sin if they remarry (vs 28) and the only condition to the deserted spouse remarrying is that they marry a saved person.

I completely agree. This is what we have on our statement of faith re: divorce and remarriage.


Divorce and Remarriage

We believe that God disapproves of and forbids divorce and intends marriage to last until one of the spouses dies. Divorce and remarriage is regarded as adultery except on the grounds of fornication or desertion by an unbeliever.

Malachi 2:14-17
Matthew 19:3-12
Romans 7:1-3
1 Corinthians 7:13-15

Generally-speaking, fornication is sex before marriage. That would be like marrying someone and finding out she lied about being sexually pure before your marriage, then divorcing her.

1 Corinthians 7:28 But and if thou marry, thou hast not sinned; and if a virgin marry, she hath not sinned. Nevertheless such shall have trouble in the flesh: but I spare you.

This is not talking about REmarriage, but about marrying in the first place.

[pbiwolski]

Originally Posted by jerry

1 Corinthians 7:28 But and if thou marry, thou hast not sinned; and if a virgin marry, she hath not sinned. Nevertheless such shall have trouble in the flesh: but I spare you.

This is not talking about REmarriage, but about marrying in the first place.

Oh, I missed that.

I Cor. 7:27-28 Art thou bound unto a wife? seek not to be loosed. Art thou loosed from a wife? seek not a wife. But and if thou marry, thou hast not sinned;...

Does Paul really have to tell someone that marrying "in the first place" is NOT a sin?