[greenbear]

Originally Posted by custer

Thanks, and please let me reiterate...From my standpoint, this is NOT an argument; it is a discussion, a lively and friendly debate! I would hope that parties here could give their scriptural positions; explain, question, and clarify; read and study; and in the end, all could be edified and taught by the Holy Ghost (John 14:26.)

Pam
www.custerfamilyfarm.com

Are you suggesting that you have an explicit Bible command for every single thing that you do or don't do in life?

No. That's a ridiculous and disingenuous question. I also don't believe that we should make up commands if they cannot be demonstrated from the scriptures.

Let me reiterate that I haven't even taken a position on this question. This "discussion" we're engaged in is nothing more than your demonstrated habit of attacking using side issues while avoiding the meat of the matter. Pam, I'm done with this "discussion". There's no point in continuing. Do you want me to admit that you are right? I couldn't care less if I'm proven wrong on everything I've said except that we had better not misapply the scriptures to support our private interpretations.

Jennifer

[George]

Aloha greenbear (Jennifer),

By now you must realize how futile it is to try to reason with someone like Pam. She is determined to be "right", even if she alienates practically everyone on the Forum

Once someone "bends", "twists", and "changes" my words or someone else's words, I write them off as being dishonest and disingenuous. Trying to deal with these kinds of people is "an exercise in futility" - as evidenced by the number of Posts that custer has posted on this Thread.

This is a woman who claimed in her Post #41 - "I DON'T want to argue", and yet she has (at this point in time) posted a total of 19 POSTS of the 89 Posts on the Thread! That's over 21% of all of the Posts on the Thread, and nearly all of them have been obstinate and argumentative.

And out of those 19 Posts - 9 of them have either been addressed to me, or has referenced me. To put it another way - nearly half of her Posts are in relation to me or something that I said. (Makes a person almost believe in Psychiatry/Psychology - but NOT QUITE! )

Pam just can't "LET GO" - she is determined to PROVE that she is right, at ALL COSTS! I'm used to this - "Westernized" (or "Americanized") women just don't know how to deal with an old curmudgeon like me. You see, having raised and trained 7 children (some probably as old or older than Pam) has given me some understanding of how to deal with women that are "out of order". I REFUSE to let them "sweet talk" me or "bully" me. If they are going to try to act like a man - I treat them like a man. And that just drives "Westernized" (or "Americanized") women like Pam NUTS!

According to the Bible Christian women are supposed to be like Sarah:

1 Peter 3:1 Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives;
2 While they behold your chaste conversation coupled with fear.
3 Whose adorning let it not be that outward adorning of plaiting the hair, and of wearing of gold, or of putting on of apparel;
4 But let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price.
5 For after this manner in the old time the holy women also, who trusted in God, adorned themselves, being in subjection unto their own husbands:
6 Even as Sara obeyed Abraham, calling him lord: whose daughters ye are, as long as ye do well, and are not afraid with any amazement.

If you want to understand what is going on I recommend that you read the Thread on Humanism. Carefully read Post #13 which deals with the perverse "Socratic" Method of teaching - employed by practically all schools in the Western world (especially colleges & universities); and Post #14 which explains "Casuistry" and "Sophism".

http://av1611.com/forums/showpost.ph...99&postcount=1

http://av1611.com/forums/showpost.ph...27&postcount=5

http://av1611.com/forums/showpost.ph...48&postcount=7

http://av1611.com/forums/showpost.ph...4&postcount=13

http://av1611.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3473&postcount=14

I believe that after you read the Thread you will understand WHERE Pam "is coming from", and WHY it is a total waste of your time and mine to try to reason with her. She has been "TRAINED" in these methodologies and her Posts clearly show it!

Look at her latest Post - #90:

Originally Posted by custer

"Thanks, and please let me reiterate...From my standpoint, this is NOT an argument; it is a discussion, a lively and friendly debate! I would hope that parties here could give their scriptural positions; explain, question, and clarify; read and study; and in the end, all could be edified and taught by the Holy Ghost (John 14:26.)
Pam"

After 19 Posts, do you accept her excuse that "this is NOT an argument"? Do you see WHERE she is coming from - "From my standpoint"? That's the WHOLE POINT! Her "standpoint" is all that she "sees" and all that she "cares about". From Pam's "standpoint" everything that has taken place on this Thread is just: "a discussion, a lively and friendly debate!" You could have fooled me!

This woman has twisted, bent, changed, and taken other people's words out of context and then inserted her words in their place - and she just considers that: "a discussion, a lively and friendly debate!" It's like I have said before, trying to reason with these kind of people is "an exercise in futility". If you don't believe me - check out Pam's "smart-alack" remark in her Post #4 on the Thread: "Biblical Marriage - Joined together or Yoked together?" http://av1611.com/forums/showpost.php?p=21996&postcount=4

It took me many years to come to an understanding of what is going on - I hope that it doesn't take as long for you.

The following verse is as true today as it was nearly 3,000 years ago:

Proverbs 27:15 A continual dropping in a very rainy day and a contentious woman are alike.

[greenbear]

George's quote:

I believe that after you read the Thread you will understand WHERE Pam "is coming from", and WHY it is a total waste of your time and mine to try to reason with her. She has been "TRAINED" in these methodologies and her Posts clearly show it!

Aloha, George!

Thanks, I would like to understand these methodologies, I'll read the threads.
Our education system has certainly devolved over the last few decades, that's for sure.

The scripture I was thinking of throughout was Jas 5:20 but at some point you have to crawl back out of the quagmire. Of course, no christian loses salvation from being wrong.
James 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

Of course, the Lord can change a believer's thinking in His own good time. He sure did mine!
Romans 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.

I pray the Lord to lead me in this way:
Romans 14:19 Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace, and things wherewith one may edify another.

grace and peace, brother George,

Jennifer

[custer]

No, Jennifer, I did not ask you to admit that I am right! (George would have said "Can you not read English?" but only to me, not you!)

It's rather funny, George, that you have nothing better to do than count all my posts and figure the percentage - TWICE! And if either one of you cared about the truth, you would also point out WHY I have posted over and over and over...here it is:

If I wanted to get answers out of either of you, I had to ask repeatedly...and, of course, some answers I STILL haven't gotten because you obviously don't have them! My latest inquiry was/is COMPLETELY FORTHRIGHT AND SINCERE - "...would you please, or can you, tell me how/if I failed to prove relevance in my post #86?" [Again, I would REALLY LOVE to know what I am missing!] Any thinking person reading this thread could not possibly misunderstand or miss the fact that nobody has answered that - which (YET AGAIN) is all I asked for!

As is your standard operating procedure, George, you went on your typical rant (about Pam and women like Pam) in an effort to keep everyone's mind off the fact that you still can't/won't answer simple questions...this time you even introduced new scripture completely off-topic to put the focus back on ME instead of on the subject at hand!

{Will someone please let George know that the topic IS NOT "PAM"?}

George, concerning my post #4 on your other marriage thread, you know the observation that you label as "smart-alack"...is my observation TRUE OR FALSE? You failed to deal with THAT!

Since you both obviously feel that I am in need of instruction (and I have REPEATEDLY, SINCERELY asked for your input,) I am still waiting for answers to my posts #68, 80, and 86. You have not been interested in teaching me, only in defaming me since you first found that my position varied from yours!

Pam
www.custerfamilyfarm.com

[greenbear]

Originally Posted by Cody1611

Galatians 3:28 "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."

The context here is not about marriage at all. It is talking about us being one in Christ, no matter if we're Jew, Greek, man, woman, etc.

The context is that the gentile church is not Israel. Only Israel was constrained (with some exceptions) not to intermarry. Gentiles are the ones Israel was forbidden to intermarry with!!! Israel being set aside for a season by God, are we the gentiles now to keep ourselves from marrying each other? That is baseless and absurd. That horse is already out of the stable, anyway, don't you think? If you believe "races" are not to intermarry in the church age, the burden of proof is on you to show that's the case from scriptures. In fact, when did God ever command gentiles not to intermarry with each other at any time?

Jennifer

[custer]

Originally Posted by greenbear

The context is that the gentile church is not Israel. Only Israel was constrained (with some exceptions) not to intermarry. Gentiles are the ones Israel was forbidden to intermarry with!!! Israel being set aside for a season by God, are we the gentiles now to keep ourselves from marrying each other? That is baseless and absurd. That horse is already out of the stable, anyway, don't you think? If you believe "races" are not to intermarry in the church age, the burden of proof is on you to show that's the case from scriptures. In fact, when did God ever command gentiles not to intermarry with each other at any time?

Jennifer

THE CONTEXT IS exactly what the verse says: "...for ye are all one IN CHRIST JESUS;" IT DOES NOT SAY "in your physical relationships!!!" Like I've said, I really want to go back to this issue with scripture, but right now I am focused on the saved/lost discussion. In the meantime, as far as your last question above, who said anything about gentiles not marrying each other?

Pam
www.custerfamilyfarm.com

WEll, I finally read through this interesting thread.

I have heard that Custer is now being "censored" and for what I don't know. I didn't see the personal attacks from her. I saw a lot of personal, defamatory remarks from George. And I saw a lot of unanswered questions.

BTW - I am not going to give my opinion on the topic. So sorry to disappoint.

[chette777]

very happy to see that here you keep that to yourself.

Unfortunately you posted your opinion in another thread. so it seems you lied about not giving your opinion on the topic.

[chette777]

I apologize then for calling you a liar. that may be true. but you mentioned this thread and then gave an opinion as to another's attitude on the other thread. that is what got me. you see it looked as though you took it there to the other thread. people are doing that a lot lately. pursuing others in others threads.

Can everyone just drop George, Custer, Parish and your attitudes and just stick to the topics. remain silent as to attitude. and if someone posts an observation about you or someone. Let it be. maybe God wants to work on someones heart, where it may just be He has been trying for sometime to get that person attention in that area. but if everyone is aggressively pursuing others how will they or you ever hear what the Lord is saying about what has been revealed.

Originally Posted by chette777

I apologize then for calling you a liar. that may be true. but you mentioned this thread and then gave an opinion as to another's attitude on the other thread. that is what got me. you see it looked as though you took it there to the other thread. people are doing that a lot lately. pursuing others in others threads.

Can everyone just drop George, Custer, Parish and your attitudes and just stick to the topics. remain silent as to attitude. and if someone posts an observation about you or someone. Let it be. maybe God wants to work on someones heart, where it may just be He has been trying for sometime to get that person attention in that area. but if everyone is aggressively pursuing others how will they or you ever hear what the Lord is saying about what has been revealed.

I thank you for your response in paragraph one.
I agree with you whole heartedly in paragraph two.

Thanks Chette!