[stephanos]

Originally Posted by EverlastingSon

Stephanos:

U say saved by grace, what does that mean to you!!

It means my salvation was a free gift of God which I did nothing to deserve, nor can I do anything to keep it. My standing in God's eyes is maintained by the fact that I am hid in Christ Jesus through my belief in the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ, the Son of God.

Colossians 3:3 (KJV) For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.

Romans 8:33 (KJV) Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

EverlastingSon, your response was peculiar. May I ask you an odd question? I will anyways, have you recieved Jesus Christ as your Savior?

Peace and Love,
Stephen

[MC1171611]

2Th. 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,

This, for starters. This is where Paul begins to speak of the end of the Church's time on earth: two verses later it says "...that day shall not come..." One of the important things abut end times prophecy in the Bible is the phrase "That day" or "the day of the Lord." These phrases speak of the Second Coming of Christ specifically, and more broadly of the Tribulation period. In this case, Paul is talking about the "catching away" or Rapture of the Church.

1Th. 4:13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.

Almost every time that the Bible says "Be not ignorant" or "I would not have you to be ignorant," people are ignorant about it. It shows up time and again, and those are usually the subjects that people don't study out. (I'm not specifically saying this about you: I'm pointing out a general truth about the Scriptures and modern Christianity) In this case Paul is telling them about the dead Christians: he's giving them hope about the resurrection.

1Th. 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
1Th. 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

Notice that he said "coming of the Lord" and not "the day of the Lord," so this isn't specifically speaking about the Second Coming of Christ, which occurs at the end of the Tribulation (Rev. 19:11), but in this case about the Rapture of the Church. The word "prevent" there doesn't mean the same thing it does today: in 1611 English that word meant "go before." Etymologically-speaking, "pre" means before, and "vent" is the root of the word "advent" or "coming," generally-speaking. The word basically means to "go before," so we will not be "going before," or leaving before, the dead in Christ.

1Th. 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

In Revelation, Jesus comes and actually lands on the earth, wearing a blood-dipped garment, riding a white horse, and destroying everything in His path ("Jesus is coming, and boy is He mad!"). In this instance, He not only comes in a different manner, but the Bible doesn't say He actually touches the ground. Reference Acts 1:11.

1Th. 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

So after Jesus comes down (without actually coming all the way to the ground) and resurrects the dead Christians, we go meet Him in the clouds (again, Acts 1:11). From that moment on, we will be with Him eternally.

1Th. 4:18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

So take heart: we don't have to endure the times of Tribulation (Jacob's Trouble, Daniel's Seventieth Week, etc.) because our Lord Jesus Christ is going to take us out of here!

Originally Posted by EverlastingSon

Vendetta Ride:
Im sorry to bring you into this brother im not going out to make enemies i hope that everyone can understand that. But tha brethren hav'nt convinced me yet i mean there is no scripture that talks about a rapture. Vendetta Ride...What does saved by grace mean to you?

It means that I am a wretched sinner, wholly deserving of God's wrath, and without hope, except in His unfathomable mercy. It means that I cannot escape Hell by any form of "good works," church attendance, "spiritual feelings," baptism, "sacraments," or even correct doctrine. It means that when I cast myself on the mercy of God, and receive Him on His terms according to John 1:12 and John 3, He will save me for His Son's sake, just as David showed kindness to Mephibosheth for Jonathan's sake. And it means that once I'm saved, and part of the body of Christ, I cannot "lose my salvation," through my own stupidities or sins, because the same grace that saved me is going to keep me.

Okay, that's my answer. Please return the favor by telling me what it mens to you.

[stephanos]

Originally Posted by Vendetta Ride

It means that I am a wretched sinner, wholly deserving of God's wrath, and without hope, except in His unfathomable mercy. It means that I cannot escape Hell by any form of "good works," church attendance, "spiritual feelings," baptism, "sacraments," or even correct doctrine. It means that when I cast myself on the mercy of God, and receive Him on His terms according to John 1:12 and John 3, He will save me for His Son's sake, just as David showed kindness to Mephibosheth for Jonathan's sake. And it means that once I'm saved, and part of the body of Christ, I cannot "lose my salvation," through my own stupidities or sins, because the same grace that saved me is going to keep me.

Okay, that's my answer. Please return the favor by telling me what it mens to you.

Man, I totally forgot about John 1:12 in my witness to that fella on youtube. That verse is such a gem!

Peace and Love,
Stephen