[peopleoftheway]

You both rant and complain about people maligning you, then go and pursue the same train of thought between yourselves, how about growing up and realising you both don't know everything about the bible either.

Good afternoon peopleoftheway, I sincerely hope you are having a good week. How are things on the other side of the pond?

The Kingdom of Heaven and the Kingdom of God are the same thing - you just have to have faith to believe it. Evidence not required.

[peopleoftheway]

Things are wonderful here thank you very much, and how are things with you my dear?

You see I can dance this dance too, I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that you love the LORD Eric, but for some reason you appear, from what you post, and what you write, to have something against KJB believers, or ruckmanites as I suppose you would term it. I understand very clearly that you were at one point a KJV onlyist and a man you trusted led you down a different path. I for one, was on the opposite end of that equation and I came out of babylon with her modern versions, social gospel, and ecumenical compromise.
I am certainly not a scholarly type and I certainly do not have a handle on many many many subjects in God's Holy Word, but I will not subject myself to anything or anyone that wishes to slam an ideal in front of me and say "eat it" or else.
You have posted that we, on this forum HATE people, that we cannot be swayed from what we believe

By the way... The people on this board HATE these guys you quoted... Their only authority is THEIR interpretation of the Bible. Everyone else is a heretic and must suffer the wrath of Almighty Atlas...

If you do not agree with them then you are wrong. And as soon as you learn that the happier you will be.

You sugar coat your words for appearances, yet on the other hand accuse us, of HATE?? What is the deal? what is your Agenda, You accuse everyone else of coming from the "I am right, you are wrong stable" yet you bolted from that one yourself without the rider or the reigns.

God Bless! If you would like sensible, reasoned CHRISTIAN conversation let me know...

Why bother with all of the Hateful people on this forum if you feel that you cant get a reasoned conversation? Whats the point ?

Why bother with all of the Hateful people on this forum if you feel that you cant get a reasoned conversation? Whats the point ?

That is a fair question. I responded on this thread the way I did because it angers me to see Adelphos mistreated. I created the other thread about the "salvation = words + faith?" because I desired to hear from this group's perspective. We discussed it on another board and we all agreed with each other, so wanted to find some other thoughts.

Things are wonderful here thank you very much, and how are things with you my dear?

Actually, I am having a wonderful day. It is very nice in Virginia today.

[George]

Adelphos Quote:

Were you in fact lying, George, when you stated, ""I don't have a complete handle on this issue"?

When someone (whom I don't know and have never met) calls me a LIAR I will have nothing more to do with them or with anything they say.

I listed 24 characteristics where the two kingdoms differ. You listed three where they are the same. If you cannot see (rightly divide) or choose to ignore the differences, then there is nothing that I can do for you. Get over it! You claim (with finality) that you "know" that they are the same, but it is obvious to Bible believers that you cannot (or will not) rightly divide the word of truth.

I have said it before (to ericwgreene and others of his ilk) that I refuse to engage SOPHISTS - there is no "profit" in it and no "edification" can be derived from someone who's "feelings" are "hurt" when presented with the truth; and who in turn call people LIARS, when I never once intimated that you were a Liar.

Rant & Rave on - You have proven to be "thin-skinned" and easily offended when presented with the truth. I have dealt with atheists and unbelievers that have been more "gracious" in a debate than you have exhibited here on this Forum. You'll not hear from me again! At least not in reference to anything that you might personally post on this Forum.

Originally Posted by ericwgreene

adelphos - I don't think it matters what you post...

Once they label you, they label you. Anything you say will be considered a heresy or with evil intentions. They will flame you and then call you a troll.

I have not read this whole thread nor will I.

If you do not agree with them then you are wrong. And as soon as you learn that the happier you will be.

God Bless! If you would like sensible, reasoned CHRISTIAN conversation let me know...

Thanks...

Hey Eric! Thanks for your comments! I am new here so I don't know any of these people. This is what shocked me about George's first post to me. I might have accepted it a little better had he introduced himself and found out a little about what I knew. However, he choose to immediately attack me (simply because I dared to disagree with him) and call me "ignorant" and "incredibly arrogant". But, alas, I've been around similar boards before and I know how to deal with guys like George

I don't blame you for not reading the thread. I might stop reading it myself

Yeah, I've already seen that if you dare to speak against their interpretations then you are patently wrong and "spreading heresy" (go figure that one out!).

Here's what I've always disliked about these boards. Not one of these 'men' would talk that way to my face. But they are allowed to do so behind the comfort of their keyboard. It's a shame. Most of these 'men' are probably nice in person but a whole different side comes out in these boards. Mostly because they realize that they will never have to stand nose to nose with anyone here.

I'm definitely interested in "reasoned CHRISTIAN conversation". What did you have in mind?

[peopleoftheway]

Simple solution, you two go off hand in hand into the sunset and interpret the Bible between yourselves and leave us hateful bunch of cowards to it.

Here's what I've always disliked about these boards. Not one of these 'men' would talk that way to my face. But they are allowed to do so behind the comfort of their keyboard. It's a shame. Most of these 'men' are probably nice in person but a whole different side comes out in these boards. Mostly because they realize that they will never have to stand nose to nose with anyone here.

Let me tell you something, If I had the opportunity I would convey the message face to face exactly the same way I would here, I fear NO man, I fear the LORD.
Have some respect for an Elder who showed you some instruction

1 Timothy 5:1 Rebuke not an elder, but intreat him as a father; and the younger men as brethren;

Yeah, I've already seen that if you dare to speak against their interpretations then you are patently wrong and "spreading heresy" (go figure that one out!).

Listen, someone has to be telling the truth if opinions are opposite, one is truth, one is heresy, If you are right about the Word of God, stand up for it, don't throw the toys out of the pram when someone admonishes you.
George is right about it (IN MY OPINION) and he stands up for what he believes and speaks out against anyone that brings a doctrine contrary to the one he has learned, the Bible commands this.

Romans 16:17
Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

Let me tell you that there are MANY genuine loving Born again Bible believing Christians on this forum and you two, in the space of 2 or three posts between you have labeled most of us as Haters, Cowards and the like. I am glad that you know how to "deal with" men like George as I am quite confident he knows how to deal with men like you.

This Is a Clear example of why this Board needs a statement of Faith, But that would defeat the purpose of the board and that's a shame

Originally Posted by George

Adelphos Quote:
When someone (whom I don't know and have never met) calls me a LIAR I will have nothing more to do with them or with anything they say.

Wow George! Perhaps you should have considered this BEFORE you made your ad hominem filled post to me (someone that you "don't know and have never met")

Noticeably George didn't attempt to defend his "lying" but only objected to the fact that I suggested that he was lying.

I listed 24 characteristics where the two kingdoms differ. You listed three where they are the same. If you cannot see (rightly divide) or choose to ignore the differences, then there is nothing that I can do for you.

George the first 11 of your "24 characteristics" are filled with ridiculous statements such as (and I quote)

1. Birds fly in heaven -they do not fly in God.

Please tell me George how this proves that the kingdom of God and the kingdom of heaven are different (or the same for that matter)?

Not until you get to #12 do you offer anything related to the discussion

12. You can only enter the Kingdom of God by the new birth - entry into the kingdom of heaven has no such requirement!

This is precisely why I started with #12! I demonstrated right off that your first "opinion" was WRONG. Jesus, in Matt. 19, clearly taught that "eternal life" was equivalent to entering the "kingdom of heaven" and then stated that same about "the kingdom of God". If you cannot see (rightly divide) this, George, then I have to be honest with you..."there is nothing that I can do for you"!

In addition, I answered the next one on your "opinion" list --

13. There are some "mysteries" concerning the kingdom of heaven - that do not coincide with the "mysteries" concerning the Kingdom of God (These "mysteries" are revealed to some people and NOT to others).

George, go back and read my post AGAIN. I proved without question that this "opinion" of yours was WRONG. Why is it so hard for you to "rightly divide the word of truth" George? I gave you SCRIPTURE that proved that your "opinion" was WRONG and you ignored it. Why George? Are you scared of the TRUTH?

Really, you didn't even attempt to answer the scriptures that I gave you and Herami. All you did was post another ad hominem filled post and threaten to ignore me. To quote one of your 'friends' -- "Congratulations"!

I had planned to work through your "opinion" list but I didn't have the time to do it all the other night. I'll be happy to answer EVERY ONE of your points! OR I could slap down my own list and demand that you answer ME.

You see, George, it is EASY to make a long list but it is another thing entirely to be able to defend that list when confronted with Scripture. Why should I move on to any more of your points when you haven't even addressed your first TWO erroneous points?

Get over it! You claim (with finality) that you "know" that they are the same, but it is obvious to Bible believers that you cannot (or will not) rightly divide the word of truth.

No, George, you have it all wrong! YOU claim to know that they are different, but it is obvious to us Bible believers that you cannot (or will not) righrly divide the word of truth! Why do your refuse to deal with the scriptures that I've presented George?

I have said it before (to ericwgreene and others of his ilk) that I refuse to engage SOPHISTS - there is no "profit" in it and no "edification" can be derived from someone who's "feelings" are "hurt" when presented with the truth; and who in turn call people LIARS, when I never once intimated that you were a Liar.

Oh no, George, you are too 'nice' to call me a "liar". Instead you called me "ignorant" and "incredibly arrogant". All this and you readily admit that you don't know me nor have you ever met me!

George, since when is it WRONG to call someone a "liar" when it is CLEAR that they were "lying"?

Rant & Rave on - You have proven to be "thin-skinned" and easily offended when presented with the truth. I have dealt with atheists and unbelievers that have been more "gracious" in a debate than you have exhibited here on this Forum. You'll not hear from me again! At least not in reference to anything that you might personally post on this Forum.

Yeah, yeah, yeah....I've heard all that before George! How do I know that YOU aren't an "atheist and unbeliever"? The way you have attacked me makes me wonder.

Hate to see you go George I was just warming up to you!

Originally Posted by peopleoftheway

Simple solution, you two go off hand in hand into the sunset and interpret the Bible between yourselves and leave us hateful bunch of cowards to it.

Isn't that what you and George are doing Mr. POTW? Why does it bother you SO much that someone actually sees things DIFFERENT than YOU?

Additionally, I don't recall calling you or anyone else here a "hateful bunch of cowards" -- those were YOUR words not mine.

Let me tell you something, If I had the opportunity I would convey the message face to face exactly the same way I would here, I fear NO man, I fear the LORD.

And maybe you would but you might also have your Christianity checked if you dared to speak to me after the manner that George has I don't take kindly to being railed upon for no reason.

Have some respect for an Elder who showed you some instruction

1 Timothy 5:1 Rebuke not an elder, but intreat him as a father; and the younger men as brethren;

First of all, YOU are not my "Elder". I "don't know you and have never met you". How can you claim to be my "Elder"?

What "instruction" did you show me? All I saw was where you posted, "Delivered with plenty of gall and bitterness, congratulations." Is that your "instruction"?

I was going to ignore your Shimei tactics but since you brought it up.....how could you know what was in my heart when I wrote that message? You didn't! But you felt it necessary to pass a judgement (Matt. 7:1) on me that you didn't even know. The truth is that I didn't write that paragraph with ANY "gall and bitterness" whatsoever! Often times in these forums it is how something is READ and not WRITTEN. YOU might have READ it that way but I didn't WRITE it that way.

Listen, someone has to be telling the truth if opinions are opposite, one is truth, one is heresy, If you are right about the Word of God, stand up for it, don't throw the toys out of the pram when someone admonishes you.

NO, you are wrong Mr. POTW! Just because we differ in "opinions" doesn't by default make one of us have "truth" and the other "heresy". It is possible that we are BOTH wrong!

thy word is truth.

This is why I have made all my appeals to God's word! Thy word is truth! I could be wrong but the word is "truth". I have appealed to the "word" and all I got in return was ad hominem attacks from George and his "list" with no "word" to back it up. And then when I pointed out to him that the "word" clearly showed that he was WRONG he again "ranted and raved" but never demonstrated that "thy word" was wrong.

George is right about it (IN MY OPINION) and he stands up for what he believes and speaks out against anyone that brings a doctrine contrary to the one he has learned, the Bible commands this.

You have every right to your opinion. And I have the right to defend my honesty, intellect, and character. I also have the right to speak out when YOU or George "bring a doctrine contrary to the one" taught in my Bible. George might have "learned" that the kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God are different but he didn't learn it from the Bible. There are simply too many scriptures proving this to be wrong. The Bible commands me to point this out to you (and anyone else).

Romans 16:17
Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

This is sound advice. I have 'marked' George and plan to "avoid" him. Thanks for encouraging me in this.

Let me tell you that there are MANY genuine loving Born again Bible believing Christians on this forum and you two, in the space of 2 or three posts between you have labeled most of us as Haters, Cowards and the like. I am glad that you know how to "deal with" men like George as I am quite confident he knows how to deal with men like you.

There you go putting words in my mouth again! I came here innocently. I made a few posts (none of which were directed to YOU or George). It was George that JUMPED on me calling me many insulting names. The funny things is that YOU never once "instructed" George. Why Mr. POTW? Why didn't you "rebuke" George for the "gall and bitterness" first post he made to a guy that he admits he doesn't know and has never met. I guess this is one of those 'good old buddies' forum....do you know what that is Mr. POTW? The ones where all you do is slap each other on the back each day and then slap anyone who dares to enter and correct you ON THE FACE! All the while passing it off as "instruction".

Oh yeah, and if they present SCRIPTURE that proves you don't know what you are talking about you claim they are not "Bible believers" and are "ignorant" and "incredibly arrogant" and are "spreading heresy" ad nauseum!

This Is a Clear example of why this Board needs a statement of Faith, But that would defeat the purpose of the board and that's a shame

Would that "statement of faith" say that in order to be a member of this board you MUST believe that the kingdom of God and the kingdom of heaven are two entirely different kingdoms?

If so, you wouldn't be bothered with Jesus stopping by because he clearly taught that they were one in the same.

Or maybe the "statement of faith" could simply say:

"In order to be a member of this board you must agree to agree with everything George and Mr. POTW believe."

That would solve your whole dilemma!