Aussiemama! I beg your pardon. I saw your name and thought that you'd started the thread. I often make that mistake.

My mind is not what it once was....

LOL no I would not have started this topic. I only added to it. I wanted to make one good post on the subject and then leave it alone because I figured I would be outnumbered but that doesn't change what I believe. Since I am outnumbered and it's sensitive, though, I only really wanted to make one post. I also did not intend to stir the pot which is why I wanted to have it all collected in one post so that I did not appear to be arguing. I just wanted to present another viewpoint. I don't plan on saying much more on the subject. I won't promise that it and this will be my only posts because the minute I do that something will happen and I'll add to it lol.

[MC1171611]

A few things I wanted to point out:

1) Noah cursed Canaan, not Ham. Also there is no proof that Ham actually sodomized his father; all it says is that he looked upon him.

2) There is little to no evidence for "Pangea" or the supercontinent alluded to previously. Like Kent Hovind says: "If you take the water out of the oceans, you'll notice there's 'dirt' underneath. We're not just lily pads floatin' around here, folks!" The combination of Peleg and Joktan (division, shortened lifespans) points to a melting of the ice caps ("Ice Age," very short, post-flood) within a few hundred years of the flood. If the ocean levels were to be lowered by a few hundred feet, all the earth's landmasses would be connected by land bridges. Therefore it is more sensible to assume that the division spoken of here is the rising of the oceans that separated the continents.

3) God established the boundaries of the nations for specific reasons. Some had to do with prophecy (Gen. 9:27 for instance), and I believe He wanted to sequester some away from the rest for His own good reasons. According to the Scriptures, God designed the habitations of the different nations to keep them apart: He intended for distance and geographical features to inhibit intermingling, but largely (if not solely) for the purpose of keeping His chosen people holy before Him.

The main reason that God was against inter-"racial" marriage was because He knew the heathen would lead His people astray. Today, the largest problem with intercultural marriage is cultural differences, not Scriptural commands. There are going to be issues when getting involved with other backgrounds and cultures, so one must be aware of that when looking for a mate.

Overall, there is no clear-cut command to not marry outside one's "race." God created one race: the human race.

I will add one more thing...I don't know how interracial couples manage...my husband and I are in a cross cultural marriage (both European) and even that is hard enough!

[Brother Tim]

Aussiemama, if the information that you gave comes from Dr. Ruckman's book, then he has another strike against him in my book. (That makes 2 and 1/2 strikes).

NO proof of a homosexual act.

Canaan was cursed, not Ham. Canaanites are not black.

Nowhere in the Bible is there a universal command not to marry outside one's culture or nationality. The Hebrew nation was under restriction, but other nations were not. Therefore, it does not apply to Gentiles, including Christians. If there were any such restriction, it would have been repeated in the NT, particularly since there was clear evidence of intermarrying between nationalities within the church.

Segregation is a vile belief, and those who encourage it are blind at best, and wicked at worst.

[MC1171611]

Originally Posted by Brother Tim

Aussiemama, if the information that you gave comes from Dr. Ruckman's book, then he has another strike against him in my book. (That makes 2 and 1/2 strikes).

NO proof of a homosexual act.

Canaan was cursed, not Ham. Canaanites are not black.

Nowhere in the Bible is there a universal command not to marry outside one's culture or nationality. The Hebrew nation was under restriction, but other nations were not. Therefore, it does not apply to Gentiles, including Christians. If there were any such restriction, it would have been repeated in the NT, particularly since there was clear evidence of intermarrying between nationalities within the church.

Segregation is a vile belief, and those who encourage it are blind at best, and wicked at worst.

Bro. Tim, Doc teaches on these things, and he does believe Ham sodomized Noah, but you can be assured everything that he says in his book is his belief backed up with Scripture. Many times people get all bent out of shape because of something Doc supposedly teaches, when it's usually just something he believes and writes about as such in a "take-it-or-leave-it" manner.

Not everything people say about Doc is correct, even those who like or agree with him.

[Brother Tim]

MC said,

...everything that he says in his book is his belief backed up with Scripture.

MC, just because a teacher quotes Scripture verses to back up his belief does not make him right. I'm sure that you know that, but your sentence implies it.

Since all that is said about the act of Ham is said in Genesis 9:22-24:

And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without...And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him.

Where could homosexuality be seen here?! What I believe may have taken place is that Ham may have mocked his father to his brothers. Their reaction could imply this, and Noah's reaction could have followed after he learned what was said. To reach for more is adding to the story without support.

[George]

Originally Posted by aussiemama

I will add one more thing...I don't know how interracial couples manage...my husband and I are in a cross cultural marriage (both European) and even that is hard enough!

Aloha Aussiemama,

It's all very simple really. My wife and I have been married for 47.5 years and in all of those years I have never seen another couple that are of "One Mind" and of "One Heart" as we are.

#1. We are from different "races": She = Filipina & I am Caucasian.

#2. We are from different "cultures": She = Filipino/Hawaiian & I am New England/American.

#3. We were both very "young": she = 17 was years of age & I was 20.

#4. We both came from different "religions": she was Roman Catholic & I was a fairly new Bible believing Christian (no particular "Denomination").

We didn't have "3 strikes" against us - We had 4 "strikes" against us!

How did we make it? LOVE & GRACE! First of all, there has been God's love and His grace - in that around three years after we were married my wife got saved (received the Lord Jesus Christ as her personal Saviour), which solved any of the differences that existed between us {we both now had "the mind of Christ"}.

Secondly, we both have never let anything or anyone come between us! That means houses & lands; money, bank accounts, or possessions. It also included: mothers & fathers; sisters & brothers; aunts or uncles; children or friends. We have been ONE, not only in flesh, but also in heart and in mind.

The order of our "priorities" are: God First (in everything); Our marriage second (before children & friends); and everything else in their order. In 47 years of marriage, I can honestly say that the word "DIVORCE" has never entered my mind - No not once!

In the last 10 years we have had perfect strangers (mostly women) come up to us and exclaim: "You look so happy together"; or "When I see you together, it makes me feel so good"; or "I am encouraged about my marriage when I see you both together"; etc. My wife and I have been sitting in a restaurant and a woman (a perfect stranger) has come up to her and said: "have you ever seen the way he (me) looks at you?"

Why do suppose it has been this way for 47+ years? Because it was genuine "love" to begin with, and there was a definite "commitment" on both of our parts to MARRIAGE (God's Institution) FIRST, and each other SECOND. And whenever our love and devotion to each other may have "faltered" (and it has on a very few occasions), our COMMITMENT to God and to our marriage (God's Institution) has carried us through.

My wife is the closest woman that I have ever met to beineg God's "perfect" woman {Proverbs 31}. I have never met another Christian couple that are as "close" together as we are. I'm sure they are out there - It's just in the 50 years that I have been saved, I personally have not seen it.

If your "priorities" are right {as a couple}, you can overcome all "obstacles". If you allow "anything" or "anyone" to come between you {as a couple} you're going to have "problems".

[KJBPrincess]

Good post, George! That is an awesome testimony!

[Brother Tim]

I've heard of a number of couples who were so close that they could tell what each other was thinking. Then I met one fellow who had gone a step farther; his wife told him what to think!