[Beltfed_0331]

I often struggle with this topic and ask myself if God can work through a translation that is not the inspired word of God. John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
We see the first step for salvation is the word. Who’s word? God’s word.
Acts 19:2-6 He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost. And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus. When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied. ...
Could it be that there are people who hear the wrong interpretation of scripture and be saved. Not here they have to hear correct scripture to have faith granted unto them. In order for an individual to be saved he must have faith. We learn from scripture that faith in God is not a natural thing for us.
2 Thessalonians 3:2 And that we may be delivered from unreasonable and wicked men: for all men have not faith.
How do we receive faith?
Romans 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
Is it the word of God being presented? Without scripture the Holy Spirit will not grant us faith.
It is scripture that permits the Holy Spirit to work.
Luke 24:32 And they said one to another, Did not our heart burn within us, while he talked with us by the way, and while he opened to us the scriptures?
If it not scripture being used then I say it cannot be the Holy Spirit convicting. The words alone are not going to save anyone.
2 Corinthians 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
Romans 10:3-4 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

[peopleoftheway]

I think If the message of Christs "Finished" work on the cross, is understood, if A person "Believes" that Christ died on the cross for their sins, that he was buried and rose again in 3 days, if they realise that they are a dirty rotten hellbound sinner and no one can save them only Christ, and in their heart they believe this and accept the Free Gift of salvation, then they may be saved, be it through a modern perversion or even as George says a simple gospel tract. Its from the point of salvation onwards that perversions weaken Christians and promote heresy, I know christians that I have no doubt are saved, but weak,why? because of modern perversions, I do not believe the same truths can be discovered in these versions,(I refuse to call them bibles) because I believe that the Holy Spirit of God will not sit with that reader and lead him or her into truth and convict them of error.
Scripture is MOST important after salvation, it is our means of deepening our relationship with Christ, growing in his word, it is the guide on all things spiritual for christian living and matters of the faith.
If a complicated piece of machinery was assembled without a proper instruction manual it would end up assembled contrary to the manufacturer's specifications, parts missing, things not working how they should etc (the old, where did these extra screws and bolts come from?)
We as God's Children are infinitely more complicated and without the guidance of His Word to edify us, we become broken, pieces where they shouldn't be (wrested scripture) and parts that don't work at all (Heresy).
Our manual on how we are supposed to be built and how we are supposed to work and our entire foundation, is built on our cornerstone Jesus Christ and his written Word , the King James 1611, THE BIBLE!
Get it out and assemble yourselves brothers and sisters

edit
I may have steered a little off topic, but I wrote it out in faith and I don't want to delete it

[peopleoftheway]

I think If the message of Christs "Finished" work on the cross, is understood, if A person "Believes" that Christ died on the cross for their sin, that he was buried and rose again in 3 days, if they realise that they are a dirty rotten hellbound sinner and no one can save them only Christ, and in their heart they believe this and accept the Free Gift of salvation, then they may be saved, be it through a modern perversion or even as George says a simple gospel tract. Its from the point of salvation onwards that perversions weaken Christians and promote heresy, I know christians that I have no doubt are saved, but weak,why? because of modern perversions, I do not believe the same truths can be discovered in these versions,(I refuse to call them bibles) because I believe that the Holy Spirit of God will not sit with that reader and lead him or her into truth and convict them of error.
Scripture is MOST important after salvation, it is our means of deepening our relationship with Christ, growing in his word, it is the guide on all things spiritual for christian living and matters of the faith.
If a complicated piece of machinery was assembled without a proper instruction manual it would end up assembled contrary to the manufacturer's specifications, parts missing, things not working how they should etc (the old, where did these extra screws and bolts come from?)
We as God's Children are infinitely more complicated and without the guidance of His Word to edify us, we become broken, pieces where they shouldn't be (wrested scripture) and parts that don't work at all (Heresy).
Our manual on how we are supposed to be built and how we are supposed to work and our entire foundation, is built on our cornerstone Jesus Christ and his written Word , the King James 1611, THE BIBLE!
Get it out and assemble yourselves brothers and sisters

[Beltfed_0331]

Originally Posted by peopleoftheway

I think If the message of Christs "Finished" work on the cross, is understood, if A person "Believes" that Christ died on the cross for their sins, that he was buried and rose again in 3 days, if they realise that they are a dirty rotten hellbound sinner and no one can save them only Christ, and in their heart they believe this and accept the Free Gift of salvation, then they may be saved, be it through a modern perversion or even as George says a simple gospel tract. Its from the point of salvation onwards that perversions weaken Christians and promote heresy, I know christians that I have no doubt are saved, but weak,why? because of modern perversions, I do not believe the same truths can be discovered in these versions,(I refuse to call them bibles) because I believe that the Holy Spirit of God will not sit with that reader and lead him or her into truth and convict them of error.
Scripture is MOST important after salvation, it is our means of deepening our relationship with Christ, growing in his word, it is the guide on all things spiritual for christian living and matters of the faith.
If a complicated piece of machinery was assembled without a proper instruction manual it would end up assembled contrary to the manufacturer's specifications, parts missing, things not working how they should etc (the old, where did these extra screws and bolts come from?)
We as God's Children are infinitely more complicated and without the guidance of His Word to edify us, we become broken, pieces where they shouldn't be (wrested scripture) and parts that don't work at all (Heresy).
Our manual on how we are supposed to be built and how we are supposed to work and our entire foundation, is built on our cornerstone Jesus Christ and his written Word , the King James 1611, THE BIBLE!
Get it out and assemble yourselves brothers and sisters

edit
I may have steered a little off topic, but I wrote it out in faith and I don't want to delete it

POTW post: "I do not believe the same truths can be discovered in these versions,(I refuse to call them bibles) because I believe that the Holy Spirit of God will not sit with that reader and lead him or her into truth and convict them of error."
Then how can the Spirit work in salvation and truelly convict them of error?
POTW post:"If a complicated piece of machinery was assembled without a proper instruction manual it would end up assembled contrary to the manufacturer's specifications, parts missing, things not working how they should etc (the old, where did these extra screws and bolts come from?)"
I am begining to agree with you with this illustration. How can that machine ever produce an authentic copy? How can a perverse bible ever produce a true christian?

[peopleoftheway]

sorry about the double post , maybe an admin can remove one.
I believe that if the simplicity that is in Christ is understood, regardless of what bible is used, or what gospel tract its not the bible itself or the tract itself that that "saves" Its Jesus Christ. Its the edifying of the Christian after salvation, if the person accepted Christ through what someone was witnessing to them through a perversion, the simple gospel message is still intact to some extent and If their heart is genuine in regards to the message and accepting Christ then the Holy Spirit of course will still be at work, the person that is being witnessed to may be ignorant of the bible issue so I guess it would be wrong to say that no one can be saved unless its a King James Bible in fact it is not necessary for a bible to be present to be saved, just the message of the Gospel of Christ and if anyone cant explain that to another, then that person shouldn't be witnessing in the first place. Its the truth that that Christian "should" be receiving after salvation for exhortation and edification that is sorely lacking through perversions, leaving a brother or sister weak and spiritually barren unable to grow in Grace and to come to a deeper understanding of The person of Jesus Christ and his written Word. This is what I think, there are many other learned men on this forum that may be able to answer better but this is what I see as a "Growing babe in Christ"

[Beltfed_0331]

I to am very interested in what many other learned men on this forum would be able to answer in this issue of salvation first and then growing in Christ.
I believe that scripture is neccessary in allowing the Holy Spirit to do His work. Which not only draws us to repentance but gives us the faith we need to believe. Does the KJV need to be present at that time? No, it should be memorized, you could write down on a napkin, whatever is needed for them to have the scripture. Scripture is the key.
Romans 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
Is it the word of God being presented? Without scripture the Holy Spirit will not grant us faith.
It is scripture that permits the Holy Spirit to work.
Luke 24:32 And they said one to another, Did not our heart burn within us, while he talked with us by the way, and while he opened to us the scriptures?
If it not scripture being used then I say it cannot be the Holy Spirit convicting. The words alone are not going to save anyone.
2 Corinthians 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
In my life I did not take the doctrine of baptism seriously for 9 years and I never grew because I failed to do what was required of me.
I agree with you that using a corrupted bible will hinder one in growing in the Lord. I just also believe that if the Holy Spirit cannot help one of His own with that book then He cannot help one while he is lost.

If the definition of a heretic is correct below those the use perverted versions are heretic or those the say the King James is the only word of God, are heretic, some one is.

Question is are Heretic saved?

HERETIC, a. [Gr. arpmr&xoc; It. eretico;
Fr. heretique.]
1. A person under any religion, but particularly
the christian, who holds and teaches
opinions repugnant to the established
faith, or that which is made the standard
of orthodoxy. In strictness, among christians,
a person who holds and avows re-~
ligious opinions contrary to the doctrines
of Scripture,

[Beltfed_0331]

Reading many of your recent threads and posts I feel that we do agree on many things. I appreciate your thoughts and input on many topics. I am left wondering what this post means. This sounds like catholic doctrine. How do you fall in that definition? I read that the definition is not complete. Thinking about this in reference to the topic. If a person who has received Christ and falls into sin by believing in another word, uses that word to present Christ, leads them with a sincere prayer, does this person receive the holy Spirit? The initial thread was indicating one can be saved but not allowed to grow in faith because the scripture was corrupt. I am wondering how the members here believe on this.

[QUOTE]

Originally Posted by Beltfed_0331

Reading many of your recent threads and posts I feel that we do agree on many things. I appreciate your thoughts and input on many topics. I am left wondering what this post means. This sounds like catholic doctrine. How do you fall in that definition?

I am not sure exactly what you mean. I did not think of perversions Versions as being a catholic doctrine, however they may think the King James is a perversions and causes people to lose there salavtion.

I read that the definition is not complete. Thinking about this in reference to the topic. If a person who has received Christ and falls into sin by believing in another word, uses that word to present Christ, leads them with a sincere prayer, does this person receive the holy Spirit?

That is whole different subject, which I noticed you commented on already, Holy Ghost - Holy Spirit. I will publish a small paper on that soon.

The initial thread was indicating one can be saved but not allowed to grow in faith because the scripture was corrupt. I am wondering how the members here believe on this.

I was wonder if a person can be saved with a corruptable seed, see we are born again of a incorruptable seed. If one is saved with a corruptable seed does that mitigate the word of God to a reward book?

Originally Posted by Beltfed_0331

I am begining to agree with you with this illustration. How can that machine ever produce an authentic copy? How can a perverse bible ever produce a true christian?

One thing in this post I sincerely disagree with is anyone saying that the Holy Spirit cannot work through an NIV or NAS Bible to save souls. What you just said was that God is powerless without a KJV Bible. God wins souls with enormous disasters overseas, death of loved ones, bith defects, all sorts of things. Far be it from me to think he couldn't use a Bible.

The NIV shows you the same plan of salvation as the KJV. Jesus laid out the way of salvation. I don't remember ANY version of the Bible in his plan.