[Paladin54]

Your thoughts?

[atlas]

Paladin54,

Can you ask a better question brother? That question is just very open.


Atlas

[Paladin54]

lol Sorry, I had to post and get off quickly.

Can a loving God predestinate people regarding their salvation? While it is impossible for God to allow any unsaved man condemned by the Law, would he refuse a man the chance to get salvation? I struggle with this thought. I do not accept predestination, but I want to hear your thoughts on the (much more specific) of: Can a loving God force someone to never gain salvation?

[Diligent]

Originally Posted by Paladin54

Can a loving God predestinate people regarding their salvation? While it is impossible for God to allow any unsaved man condemned by the Law, would he refuse a man the chance to get salvation?

No.

Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men

I struggle with this thought. I do not accept predestination,

You have to accept predestination, as Paul explicitly says it. What you do not have to accept is a theological system that redefines what is predestined. See this post where I explain my understanding of predestination.

[Paladin54]

Of course Brandon, I forget that predestination was "redefined". It just feels like the more spiritually developed people at my school and church take this theology, so I was gettinga little intimidated....foolish me.

This thread is sufficient for me-had I known it was discussed on another forum...

Thanks again, Brother Brandon.

Originally Posted by Paladin54

Your thoughts?

all 5 points of calvinism go against the bible in some way shape or form. and on the other side much of armenianism is the same way..

i don't follow man's doctrine.. i just follow the bible, and i don't use private interpretations of it, i let the bible speak for itself.

Here's a link that might answer some questions:

What Is Biblical Predestination?

I joined my local Baptist Church 3 years and with which I remained for the next year and a half. After a while I realized that the pastor of this church, along with many other members, were comfortable calling themselves "calvinists". This caused me to start studying the subject of calvinism intensely so I would have the proper tools to challenge these members (including the pastor) who called themselves calvinists. The best book (and simplest too) and the most thorough book I ever read on this subject is "What Love is this??", by Dave Hunt, from Oregon.
Contrary to what Calvin taught, our loving God wants everyone to be saved from hell and is not willing that any should perish (as His Word says.). Liz

It is very possible that many people who call themselves "calvinists" do so only because they believe in the doctrine of OSAS (once saved always saved). Yet, we do not have to call ourselves "calvinists" to believe that once we are saved, we are saved forever, as Jesus himself said:" NOthing shall pluck them(my sheep) out of my hand"

[Diligent]

Originally Posted by liz

It is very possible that many people who call themselves "calvinists" do so only because they believe in the doctrine of OSAS (once saved always saved). Yet, we do not have to call ourselves "calvinists" to believe that once we are saved, we are saved forever, as Jesus himself said:" NOthing shall pluck them(my sheep) out of my hand"

Calvinism's fifth tenet is "perseverance of the saints." While Calvinisim has it right that believers cannot lose their salvation, it is wrong to put the emphasis on perseverance -- the promise is preservation.